00:05 Johnjay: hmm, someone in an emu channel was complaining about nouveau
00:05 Johnjay: how does it do compared to the nvidia one for most situations?
00:05 gnarface: great unless you're a gamer
00:05 imirkin_: worse.
00:06 imirkin_: [presumably in an emu channel, they're concerned about gaming rather than regular 2D usage]
00:06 gnarface: oh, emu as in emulator, not the bird. i follow now.
00:07 imirkin_: i'm guessing emu's don't care one way or another :p
00:07 imirkin_: they just stick their head in the sand and let it pass.
00:07 gnarface: i can't imagine a single situation where nouveau wouldn't be superior to nvidia for viewing pictures of emus
00:07 Johnjay: yeah it's dolphin i'm thinking of
00:08 Johnjay: although an emu channel for the bird might be fun too
00:08 Johnjay: er, yeah. i'm only talking about 3d
00:08 gnarface: for dolphin (the emulator) probably the nvidia drivers are better
00:08 RSpliet: If it's a D3D9 rendered emu, nouveau can do this natively whereas the blob will have to use Wine's DX->GL translation...
00:09 RSpliet: but... that's about the only slight edge that I can give nouveau over blob
00:09 gnarface: there's one corner case where nouveau is better for gaming specifically if you're using wine-gallium-nine, i think that's what you're talking about RSpliet but i don't think that's the case for dolphin (which is a nintendo emulator)
00:09 RSpliet: gnarface: yes that's what I was joking about ;-)
00:11 RSpliet: mmm, that and it tends to have a slightly better out-of-the-box experience for most distros as it's part of the standard software stack. the blob does occasionally fail on dkms with big kernel updates and the likes, esp if you don't grab blob from a package manager (but who really does that anyway?)
00:12 gnarface: yes, xrandr and multi-head support for nouveau seems better still than nvidia even after all these years, but that's not quite a gaming concern
00:12 imirkin_: otoh i don't think we support HDMI 2.0
00:12 imirkin_: (and it's too bad - i even have an HDMI 2.0 monitor, but no HDMI 2.0 nvidia hw)
00:12 gnarface: hmm. i don't have any cards that new, didn't notice
00:14 Johnjay: hmm. is that something you just have to sort of live with
00:14 Johnjay: because they don't release specs or whatever for the cards?
00:14 RSpliet: heh oh yes, I didn't even consider those kind of advancements... my primary monitor only does VGA and DVI
00:14 RSpliet: because they didn't have HDMI back in 2004
00:14 imirkin_: Johnjay: it's pretty easy to RE
00:14 imirkin_: Johnjay: just need to have the hardware on-hand
00:14 gnarface: Johnjay: they started requiring signed firmware with the latest cards, that's the real problem going forward.
00:15 gnarface: Johnjay: there's still hope for older cards
00:15 imirkin_: (stuff like HDMI 2.0 support, that is)
00:15 RSpliet:secretly sneaks it onto Bens todo list.. surely he has the hw :-P
00:16 imirkin_: it's still relatively rare i think
00:16 imirkin_: i splurged on a nice tv :)
00:16 RSpliet: and it's not as if his todo list was too long already O:-)
00:16 imirkin_: my main desktop monitor is also still DVI + VGA :)
00:16 gnarface: i just keep hoping saner heads will prevail and force nvidia to comply with e-waste laws
00:16 imirkin_: although much newer than yours... it's from 2006 :)
00:17 RSpliet: Whoa.. is that like with a 16:9 resolution?
00:17 gnarface: everything i have here is still hdmi 1.4 or 1.3b, but i'm using still using DVI wherever possible instead. HDMI is a boondoggle
00:18 imirkin_: RSpliet: 16:10
00:18 RSpliet: This one is erm... 5:4. But don't want to replace it for anything less than 4k (I need more vertical pixels)
00:19 imirkin_: in each direction!
00:19 imirkin_: at work i use 2x 24" rotated displays
00:19 imirkin_: for a total of 2400x1920. pretty nice.
00:19 imirkin_: at least i've gotten used to it over the past decade
00:19 imirkin_: each monitor can fit 2x 80-column editors
00:20 RSpliet: Yeah, I'm being a bit silly atm. That's my primary monitor, but there is a (slightly blurry, but) fullHD TV accompanying it for films. laptop is 1920x1080, work monitor sth like that...
00:21 RSpliet: come to think of it, even my smartphone has a higher resolution than my primary monitor
00:24 Johnjay: some people really love dual monitor setups
00:24 imirkin_: <--- that's me
00:25 imirkin_: 2x rotated 24" screens is all i've ever used at work.
00:26 gnarface: you can't really go back, once you realize how much better it is for getting work done, though i've seriously contemplated going to 3 now, specifically for a couple games
00:26 Johnjay: why is it better?
00:26 imirkin_: and back in the day i lugged around 19" 1600x1200 trinitron CRT's
00:27 imirkin_: didn't rotate those though!
00:27 Johnjay: i mean i'll admit i wish i had a separate desktop sometimes for gaming but do you use them at the same time?
00:27 imirkin_: yeah
00:30 gnarface: not only am i actually using them both at the same time right now i have e17 configured into a veritical array of virtual desktops so it's actually 2x4. sometimes you want a little extra space for Gimp or Blender to spread out in without occluding other windows
00:30 Johnjay: sure
00:30 Johnjay: gimp is a pain with those extra windows lol
00:31 gnarface: but, not having to alt+tab out of WoW to open a browser window is killer too
00:31 RSpliet: As an academic, most of my time my monitor has one half texmaker, one half evince... I would quite like it if I could have my sources (pdf, web) on a second monitor...
00:32 RSpliet: Also, eclipse gets better with every pixel you feed it.
00:33 RSpliet: split-screening that with stackexch.. err I mean... K&R is no fun
02:24 ylwghst_: Hello
02:25 ylwghst_: When I close lid of my laptop screen goes off then for a second again on (flashes) and then off and sucesfully suspend.
02:25 ylwghst_: I'm trying to eleminate this flash. But everything is fine if I call systemd suspend from terminal.
02:25 ylwghst_: This happens only gnome3
06:56 gnarface: incidentally, re: steam only seeing 256MB of video ram; turns out radeon and fglrx users are seeing the same problem
06:57 gnarface: steam just doesn't seem to be using GLX_MESA_query_renderer
06:57 gnarface: (known issue since 2013 according to their own bug tracker - sad)
06:58 gnarface: people with rx480 8GB still only getting 256MB of it
07:02 airlied: gnarface: I don't think it matters what steam sees in reality
07:03 gnarface: airlied: multiple people replied that to their threads too, but first-hand accounts from people who actually own the hardware and are testing it disagree. i remain skeptical.
07:17 airlied: gnarface: steam doesn't give the info to the game
07:17 airlied: now if games don't use query renderer then that is probably the problem
07:18 gnarface: also there's the issue i have about if you're using in-home streaming whether it matters if the game sees all the ram, since BPM does not
07:18 gnarface: effectively in this case BPM is playing video. it doesn't matter what the game sees. it matters what steam sees in this case.
07:19 gnarface: how much it matters is still of some dispute, but, again, only people who don't own any of this hardware nor have ever tested are claiming it can't possibly matter. all the empirical evidence on hand is to the contrary.
07:24 gnarface: (and keep in mind, it would be far from the first time steam-for-linux defied rational expectations)
10:01 karolherbst: jolar2: sorry I was a bit absent yesterday in the evening. You can just send it whatever you have to the mailing list, it doesn't need to be perfect and it also allows others to give you an early feedack as well
10:01 karolherbst: nobody expects the first sent out patch to be perfect anyhow, and not even the 1000th one
14:00 imirkin: mwk: looking at your nvhw/hwtest impl... is your claim that prior to NVA0, sat passed NaN's through? where does 'fnz' come from?
14:24 imirkin: [hm, i see, part of the context]
14:24 imirkin: i wonder if it behaves differently in graphics shaders
16:24 RSpliet: imirkin: there might be an endless hunt for chicken bits that switch behaviour (like they let you switch between DX9 and GL)?
16:26 imirkin_: welll
16:26 imirkin_: as long as there's no HALF_CHICKEN register... :)
16:30 RSpliet:wonders whether the display subsys has a HEADLESS_CHICKEN bit
16:30 imirkin_: hehehe
16:30 imirkin_: should suggest it to the intel guys