00:06 fdobridge_: <b​enjaminl> how's SM50 stuff going? I've been swamped with work stuff, and haven't really been following anything recently
00:07 fdobridge_: <b​enjaminl> maybe I'll have time to poke at NVK this weekend though
01:06 fdobridge_: <k​arolherbst🐧🦀> it already landed
01:06 fdobridge_: <k​arolherbst🐧🦀> I htink?
01:09 fdobridge_: <b​enjaminl> yeah, I think I saw the PR for the initial implementation
01:12 fdobridge_: <b​enjaminl> looks like the only thing since then is https://gitlab.freedesktop.org/mesa/mesa/-/merge_requests/26723
15:44 fdobridge_: <!​DodoNVK (she) 🇱🇹> I wonder why no one noticed this :ferris:
15:44 fdobridge_: <!​DodoNVK (she) 🇱🇹> https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1034184951790305330/1193218574140047502/message.txt?ex=65abea65&is=65997565&hm=3d8928c5da213329b3d0fad62d579ede8005d00caec63a61b48bc9d60f19351f&
16:09 fdobridge_: <e​sdrastarsis> dead code is normal atm
16:11 fdobridge_: <!​DodoNVK (she) 🇱🇹> There wasn't any before though
16:28 fdobridge_: <e​sdrastarsis> There was a lot of dead code in NAK on Faith's branch (nak/main) iirc
16:28 fdobridge_: <!​DodoNVK (she) 🇱🇹> That's not upstream though
18:13 fdobridge_: <g​fxstrand> @marysaka can mesh shaders write clip/cull dinstances?
18:13 fdobridge_: <g​fxstrand> @marysaka can mesh shaders write clip/cull distances? (edited)
18:14 fdobridge_: <g​fxstrand> Maybe older/newer rust compilers don't warn because it's inline? IDK. I'm not seeing a warning here.
18:18 fdobridge_: <g​fxstrand> Looks like yes. I'm seeing mesh interactions in the SPIR-V spec.
18:20 fdobridge_: <m​arysaka> yes
18:23 fdobridge_: <g​fxstrand> And `gl_Layer`?
18:24 fdobridge_: <g​fxstrand> But no XFB. That would be insane. No XFB, right?
18:24 fdobridge_: <g​fxstrand> (Insert Padme/Anakin meme here)
18:32 fdobridge_: <!​DodoNVK (she) 🇱🇹> 1.75.0 here
18:41 fdobridge_: <m​arysaka> There is layer not sure for XFB but I *think* I saw some conformances test for that
18:41 fdobridge_: <m​arysaka> will have to recheck
18:43 fdobridge_: <!​DodoNVK (she) 🇱🇹> <https://youtu.be/Z6XLwkyo6Nw?t=196>
19:01 fdobridge_: <g​fxstrand> Yes, that.
19:52 fdobridge_: <g​fxstrand> https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1034184951790305330/1193281076118966292/8bhvxq.jpg?ex=65ac249a&is=6599af9a&hm=5da786d17595a75194afa3310b4b04faaaa211aab5ab6d34ba2579c5514b8100&
19:56 fdobridge_: <r​hed0x> wait, it does? o_o
20:00 fdobridge_: <m​arysaka> I'm still having issues with the "multiple local invocations in one hardware local invocation" pass :vReiAgony:
20:00 fdobridge_: <g​fxstrand> Yeah, we should talk about that next week.
20:00 fdobridge_: <k​arolherbst🐧🦀> pain
20:00 fdobridge_: <m​arysaka> (phi instruction being big pain atm because I am not handling cursors across blocks)
20:01 fdobridge_: <g​fxstrand> I don't think so. I'm really hoping I'm not wrong. 😅
20:01 fdobridge_: <m​arysaka> but i have some ideas to at least handle local variables duplication properly 😓
20:06 fdobridge_: <k​arolherbst🐧🦀> do we have mesh shaders for GL?
20:08 fdobridge_: <g​fxstrand> No
20:08 fdobridge_: <g​fxstrand> Well, there's an extension but it's NV and I'd probably NAK anyway
20:08 fdobridge_: <k​arolherbst🐧🦀> wait until an GL game uses it
20:09 fdobridge_: <g​fxstrand> What GL games?
20:09 fdobridge_: <k​arolherbst🐧🦀> good point
20:09 fdobridge_: <m​arysaka> uuurgh Minecraft mods?
20:09 fdobridge_: <k​arolherbst🐧🦀> 😄
20:09 fdobridge_: <m​arysaka> I can only think of that...
20:09 fdobridge_: <k​arolherbst🐧🦀> pain
20:09 fdobridge_: <k​arolherbst🐧🦀> are there minecraft mods using raytracing?
20:09 fdobridge_: <S​id> I know there's a minecraft mod that uses mesh shaders
20:09 fdobridge_: <k​arolherbst🐧🦀> pain
20:09 fdobridge_: <k​arolherbst🐧🦀> 😄
20:10 fdobridge_: <m​arysaka> pretty sure I had some friends working on something related yeah
20:10 fdobridge_: <S​id> https://github.com/MCRcortex/nvidium
20:10 fdobridge_: <k​arolherbst🐧🦀> 😄
20:10 fdobridge_: <k​arolherbst🐧🦀> `#extension GL_NV_mesh_shader : require` pain
20:10 fdobridge_: <k​arolherbst🐧🦀> @gfxstrand does that answer your question? 😄
20:11 fdobridge_: <S​id> mod works great at improving perf too, I tried it out a while ago
20:11 fdobridge_: <k​arolherbst🐧🦀> at least for zink that's not too hard to implement
20:11 fdobridge_: <k​arolherbst🐧🦀> maybe we just add some exts and make them zink-only?
20:11 fdobridge_: <S​id> numbers are framerate
20:11 fdobridge_: <S​id> https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1034184951790305330/1193285826243735702/image.png?ex=65ac2907&is=6599b407&hm=df30e0cb7bc29cf6a52b7a0472bcd6335e341379f5f50c4c59383d13142d9c3f&
20:12 fdobridge_: <k​arolherbst🐧🦀> can mesh shaders be enabled/disabled?
20:12 fdobridge_: <S​id> on laptop 1660Ti
20:12 fdobridge_: <k​arolherbst🐧🦀> I guess them being NV only that's probably the case
20:12 fdobridge_: <k​arolherbst🐧🦀> but it would be kinda cursed if using mesh shaders makes it actually faster as well...
20:14 fdobridge_: <S​id> I think I had a long list of perf-related mods installed as well, but those numbers are taken only by toggling that one mod
20:14 fdobridge_: <k​arolherbst🐧🦀> right...
20:14 fdobridge_: <k​arolherbst🐧🦀> I'm just wondering if supporting mesh shaders actually provides any benefits here
20:14 fdobridge_: <S​id> I *can* try with *just* that mod and its requirements 🙃
20:15 fdobridge_: <g​fxstrand> Adding everything to the GLSL compiler wouldn't be trivial.
20:15 fdobridge_: <k​arolherbst🐧🦀> yeah..... not saying it's trivial
20:15 fdobridge_: <k​arolherbst🐧🦀> but adding support in every driver is also quite the work
20:18 fdobridge_: <k​arolherbst🐧🦀> but anyway, if minecraft runs at 480 fps with that mod without mesh and 490 with mesh it's "whatever"
20:18 fdobridge_: <k​arolherbst🐧🦀> but if some games have huge perf benefits from it it's a different story
20:19 fdobridge_: <g​fxstrand> I don't care about minor perf improvements in the vertex pipeline if you're already at 490 FPS.
20:19 fdobridge_: <k​arolherbst🐧🦀> 😄 fair
20:20 fdobridge_: <k​arolherbst🐧🦀> I'm sure you can throw enough mods at minecraft to make that drop to 30 fps tho
20:21 fdobridge_: <!​DodoNVK (she) 🇱🇹> Nvidium + Sodium + SEUS PTGI would be interesting 🔦
20:21 fdobridge_: <k​arolherbst🐧🦀> (or run at 4K@120)
20:21 fdobridge_: <g​fxstrand> Yeah but it's a tiny vertex improvement going to fix that?
20:21 fdobridge_: <g​fxstrand> Yeah but is a tiny vertex improvement going to fix that? (edited)
20:22 fdobridge_: <k​arolherbst🐧🦀> I hope not
20:22 fdobridge_: <k​arolherbst🐧🦀> but I'd be interested in the numbers here
20:22 fdobridge_: <g​fxstrand> Don't get me wrong, mesh is a great match for Minecraft's voxel model.
20:22 fdobridge_: <k​arolherbst🐧🦀> yeah, at this point I'm mostly curious
20:29 fdobridge_: <S​id> dunno, I saw a ~40% perf increase (frametime, not framerate)
20:29 fdobridge_: <S​id> and I don't think you can toggle mesh shaders separately in that mod
20:30 fdobridge_: <S​id> https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1034184951790305330/1193290461658480801/image.png?ex=65ac2d58&is=6599b858&hm=30f2d99fca82cd8d693f9658720b4cc9f03f92a4d45d109d46be803dccf3b699&
20:30 fdobridge_: <k​arolherbst🐧🦀> mhhhh.. so the mod only works on Nvidia GPUs, or is the mod enabling/disabling it on its own
20:30 fdobridge_: <k​arolherbst🐧🦀> ahhhh.....
20:30 fdobridge_: <k​arolherbst🐧🦀> pain
20:30 fdobridge_: <S​id> only works on nv because only nv has `GL_NV_mesh_shader` 🙃
20:31 fdobridge_: <k​arolherbst🐧🦀> mhhh which brings us back to zink...
20:31 fdobridge_: <k​arolherbst🐧🦀> so it's a +33% fps improvement using that mod?
20:31 fdobridge_: <S​id> ~38%, yeah
20:32 fdobridge_: <S​id> uh
20:32 fdobridge_: <S​id> frametime
20:32 fdobridge_: <k​arolherbst🐧🦀> though one could argue there are other mods improving perf as well without using mesh I guess
20:32 fdobridge_: <S​id> I don't measure perf in framerate 🙃
20:32 fdobridge_: <k​arolherbst🐧🦀> so that's not in fps?
20:33 fdobridge_: <S​id> those numbers are framerate because friend wanted to know
20:33 fdobridge_: <k​arolherbst🐧🦀> ahh
20:33 fdobridge_: <S​id> this is based on frametime calculated off of average framerate
20:34 fdobridge_: <S​id> [(1000/300 - 1000/490)/(1000/300)]
20:34 fdobridge_: <S​id> :P
20:36 fdobridge_: <k​arolherbst🐧🦀> I see
20:37 fdobridge_: <S​id> let me boot it up again and check, gimme a moment
20:38 fdobridge_: <S​id> ok, disabled every other mod
20:39 fdobridge_: <S​id> only sodium + nvidium, because that's what nvidium requires
20:42 fdobridge_: <S​id> heck, *something* is vsync-ing this
20:42 fdobridge_: <S​id> let me try it on x11
20:50 fdobridge_: <S​id> 5.3ms frametime with it enabled
20:52 fdobridge_: <S​id> 7.1ms without
20:52 fdobridge_: <S​id> still a 25% difference
20:53 fdobridge_: <S​id> \s/difference/increase
20:53 fdobridge_: <S​id> s/difference/increase (edited)
20:53 fdobridge_: <S​id> still a 25% difference in perf (edited)
21:15 fdobridge_: <k​arolherbst🐧🦀> yeah...
21:15 fdobridge_: <k​arolherbst🐧🦀> well.. it's one data point
21:15 fdobridge_: <k​arolherbst🐧🦀> I guess there are other mods being used improving perf for e.g. AMD gpus?
21:15 fdobridge_: <k​arolherbst🐧🦀> would be also nice to know how those compare
21:30 fdobridge_: <r​edsheep> You're only seeing 7.1ms/140 fps while on sodium alone? Adding Starlight is probably a more reasonable way to improve perf there than implementing a whole new extension in zink
21:31 fdobridge_: <r​edsheep> Especially since the nv mesh shaders extension is pretty different from the current standard mesh shaders, right?
21:31 fdobridge_: <S​id> I know, I use all those funny perf improving mods
21:31 fdobridge_: <S​id> that's how I play at 300fps 🐸
21:32 fdobridge_: <S​id> I was just testing what difference GL_NV_mesh_shader makes
21:33 fdobridge_: <r​edsheep> Right, ok. I remember seeing discussion of this elsewhere, it seems weird to support a pretty different mesh shader implementation for one application
21:34 fdobridge_: <r​edsheep> I'm the long run mods that replace GL with vulkan are probably a better idea that relying on gl_nv_mesh_shader
21:39 fdobridge_: <g​fxstrand> The fact that there's a Vulkan mod scares me a little. 😅
21:41 fdobridge_: <r​edsheep> Why is that? It is pretty ambitious, if that's what you mean. The game badly needs it though, it's so brutally CPU bound.
21:48 fdobridge_: <g​fxstrand> Mostly the fact that it's that extensible is kinda crazy.
21:57 fdobridge_: <r​edsheep> Based on the change logs over there I doubt they have a path using mesh shaders, but with how different their bottlenecks probably are they might not even help much.
22:10 EisNerd: Hi I'm looking for a workarround for https://gitlab.freedesktop.org/drm/nouveau/-/issues/188, as I'd like to get my card back usable (hoping it supports dx11 feature lev 10 via vulkan/proton)
22:10 EisNerd: if I got it right, this is sth with the hdmi audio stuff, can I disable it?
23:36 fdobridge_: <k​arolherbst🐧🦀> that's java for you 😄