01:25 damo22: i wanted to provide a little bit of feedback: this same time last year the nouveau driver seemed a bit more stable, are there any known regressions recently? just curious because libreplanet is currently running and they had to swap out different nv gpus to make the streaming more stable.
01:26 imirkin: i sorta agree, feels like it's gone to shit
01:26 imirkin: not sure how much of it is kernel regressions
01:26 imirkin: and how much is userspace changing
01:26 imirkin: to rely more and more on a shitty foundation
01:27 damo22: i see, not pointing any blame just curious
01:27 imirkin: i'm still on kernel 5.6
01:27 imirkin: feels like 5.8 or 5.9 introduced a lot of new problems
01:27 damo22: ok
01:27 imirkin: and then as those were fixed, more new ones were introduced
01:27 imirkin: "refactors", "cleanups", etc
01:28 damo22: maybe its due to the linux kernel changing so much?
01:28 imirkin: it's changed more in the past 10 releases than it had in the previous 50? doubtful.
01:32 damo22: if people are paid to work on linux kernel, they have to continue changing it otherwise they dont have a job
01:32 damo22: maybe that is the problem
01:32 imirkin: yes ... fire all the linux kernel developers. then all will be well!
01:33 damo22: lol
01:34 damo22: well they might contribute to projects like nouveau...
01:34 imirkin: it's _really_ hard to care about nouveau
01:34 damo22: why?
01:35 imirkin: coz nvidia has removed all hope of ever getting it working well
01:35 imirkin: which reduces the motivation somewhat
01:35 damo22: i felt that with coreboot + intel
01:35 damo22: they only provide a blob for raminit
01:35 imirkin: at least there's a blob
01:36 damo22: so coreboot has become a blob wrapper
01:36 imirkin: i'm not too fussed about firmware
01:36 imirkin: they just don't make anything available.
01:36 damo22: ugh
01:36 damo22: thats hard
01:36 imirkin: so anything past the first gen of maxwell
01:36 imirkin: is stuck at like 10mhz memory speeds
01:36 imirkin: which was pretty good for 1980, but no so much today
01:37 mangix: imirkin: you mean starting with pascal
01:37 damo22: is there an email contact at NV i can ask for firmware?
01:37 damo22: lol
01:37 imirkin: sure
01:37 imirkin: no-reply@nvidia.com
01:37 damo22: haha
01:37 mangix: I remember overclocking my 980 with nouveau
01:38 mangix: granted that was with karol's patch but still.
01:38 imirkin: mangix: yes, but you didn't have fan control
01:39 damo22: the binary driver must have unlocked firmware but i guess its non-redistributable
01:39 mangix: imirkin: yes i did :)
01:39 imirkin: mangix: not the built-in fan :p
01:39 mangix: hehe
01:39 imirkin: damo22: there is no locked vs unlocked firmware. it's just firmware.
01:39 imirkin: yes, it's non-redistributable
01:39 imirkin: and also something of a pain to extract
01:40 imirkin: and it doesn't have a stable ABI, and tons of stuff still needs to be handled by the driver
01:40 imirkin: however it's impossible to RE those bits now that things are locked down in the blob driver
01:40 damo22: yeah
01:40 imirkin: like parsing the memory settings in the vbios, and how those are supposed to be used to program the hw
01:41 damo22: now theres a non-removable backdoor in x86, and it uses signed fw
01:41 imirkin: ah yeah. the nvidia firmware is signed
01:41 damo22: i can probably get you a debug key :P
01:41 imirkin: but not a debug board
01:42 damo22: right
01:44 damo22: what i meant by unlocked fw is that the binary driver must have a firmware built in that uses full clock speed
01:44 imirkin: yes, absolutely
01:44 imirkin: along with the signed keys
01:44 imirkin: er. the signature for that firmware.
01:44 damo22: but youre probably not allowed to redistribute them
01:45 imirkin: definitely not.
01:45 imirkin: and also that firmware is a bit difficult to extract
01:45 damo22: right
01:45 imirkin: for the video firmware
01:45 mangix: the irony is that the tegra stuff has firmware
01:45 imirkin: we supply a script which operates on their distributed blob
01:45 imirkin: mangix: yeah, but tegra doesn't have VRAM
01:46 imirkin: or ... anything else :)
01:47 damo22: Dear NV, please supply redistributable firmware with signatures that allows full clock speeds and fan control on all your models to the nouveau project. Thank you.
01:49 imirkin: well. and also provide documentation on how to program the card with the parameters in the vbios
01:49 mangix: missing opportunity by that hacking group IMO
01:50 imirkin: heh. not sure if you're serious, but obv anything coming out of that would taint any developer who saw it
01:51 imirkin: so unless you're in some odd jurisdiction, which none of the core nouveau devs are, wouldn't be able to make any use of it or anything that comes from it
01:51 mangix: they mentioned a FOSS license so ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
01:52 imirkin: if nvidia ends up releasing the stuff on the up-and-up, i'm all for using it.